What happened to Nikkie got me thinking about the best way to catch the eye of a potential rescuer during daylight and at night. I'm looking for a waterproof flare that can be deployed by hand. This flare will be attached to the float and will be in contact with the water for a long long time before and if it is ever used. It will also get banged around a bit so it needs to be durable. Anyone know of such a product?

Also I'm thinking of other signaling devices. A mirror seems like a good idea. A whistle I already have. Today I was looking at some waterproof strobe type flashers. These have an operating life of about 8 hours with fresh batteries. Anyone with suggestions about good products for this purpose please chime in.

If you dont have a sausage GET ONE..Mirror, z knife, scuba alert, small light mandatory items...

BTW if ya find a flare lemmeknow..Thanks :smthumbup:

I'm not sure what a safety sausage is but I'm always towing a red float about 3ft long with a dive flag on it, let me know if it's a substitute. Freedivers are limited as to the amount of gear that can be towed around.

Actually It would work. You just cant see it as far as you would a sausage. The sausages are 4-6 feet and about the size of a beer can rolled up. You can see them a long way off. I think Ive seen some freedvr. floats w/ some pockets for goodies. IMO get the one w/ both yellow and orange different light conditions require different contrasts.
They can also be used as a pfd in case of emerg.

Dan, here is an article you might find interesting

http://www.equipped.com/signal.htm

Thanks Kris, excellent write up. I really like the rescue streamer. Although it would have to be deployed only when swimming is no longer an option.

http://www.equipped.com/pp/GR/see-rescue18.jpg

http://www.powerflare.com/customers/scuba.html

http://www.painswessex.com.au/Marine/flares.htm


I think this would work great, only 8 left.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=130156315481&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=003

Roland, thank you for that. I should have specified, I'm looking for the kind of flare that shoots up in the air. On second thought maybe it doesn't have to be so waterproof, just packed waterproof.

Maybe something like this

http://www.botachtactical.com/skybscub3fla.html

I would still put it in some sort of tube like the ones above.

I carried Skyblazers down on dives for several years, they are water "proof" but when I tested them, I realized they have a short burn time and not much height. Don't carry them down any more.

Roland, thanks again. I bought 2 of those army waterproof canisters, there are 6 left. Dangerous, thanks for the heads up, I'll buy regular flares to put in those.

Roland, thanks again. I bought 2 of those army waterproof canisters, there are 6 left. Dangerous, thanks for the heads up, I'll buy regular flares to put in those.

I just looked in my West Marine catalog and they sell those single shot gun flares in a four pack for 44.00 dollars.
You could put two of them in a tube.

Maybe something like this

http://www.botachtactical.com/skybscub3fla.html

I would still put it in some sort of tube like the ones above.

i have some of these on my boat...seem to be sealed properly. throw one in a o-ringed canister for redundency..good to go.

I am a new scubadiver. Looking fro some tips on safety equip. I thought about float attached to me with a rope but figured that would get tangled. I mainly dive around alot of rocks. any suggestions would be great.

Even though I bought those cases I'm still looking for something more streamlined. My idea is to simply take a PVC tube of a lenght that will fit 2 flares. PVC tubes come in a range of diameters so I'm sure it will fit very well. One end I can seal permenantly which is no problem. The end that will need to be opened however poses a problem. Any ideas?

Other than that does anyone know of any slim tube type waterproof canister? I haven't been able to find anything online.

The simplest route would be a threaded pipe plug, but if you screw it in enough to be water tight, it may be hard to remove later with bare (or gloved) hands. A plumber's plug might work, as the smaller ones are meant to be installed and removed without tools:

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w32/Jeffs_network_pics/pipeplug.jpg

One other thought. How about making your tube out of clear PVC pipe, so that you could quickly tell if water was leaking in?

Tin man, I was at home depot today trying out the threaded caps, they would be very difficult to remove when wet if screwed on to the point of being water tight. I have never seen those other plugs with the washer, are they available at home depot? They look promising. Also the clear PVC tube is a great idea, condensation inside the tube would be immediately apparent. Where can I get rigid clear PVC tubing? You can always be counted on to come up with somehting innovative :)

I don't know if Home Depot carries the "plumber's plugs" or not, but they are available from www.mcmaster.com, where they are listed as "pipe test plugs". McMaster has the clear PVC pipe as well. Looking forward to some pictures!

Clear PVC can usually be purchased at a local plastics dealer or try this website http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/default.asp?cookie%5Ftest=1

How about an underwater light without the batteries? It would at least carry one good size flare. Just a thought.

2 weeks ago the show Survivor man had an episode about a stranded diver on a tropical island in the South Pacific. He had some one shot flares that he had carried with him. THey was slightly larger than a pencil and green in color. He pasically pulled a pin and then when he let it go it snapped and the flare fired. He wasnt using it for signaling but to lite a fire. It seemed to work extreamly well though...

In light of Nikki disappearing it had made me realize that no one is safe in the water no matter how you prepare. All you can do is take certain actions to prevent things like this happening. I already have a safety sausage but im going to be investing in a few more devices after this recent event. It has surely opened my eyes to the sudden danger of being lost at sea. I plan on purchasing a whistle and looking for flares I can keep in a BC pocket.

After a little searching I found this product, seems like a decent device but its not flare. Its small at 4.5"x 1.5"...Would easily fit in a BC pocket and is waterproof to 300'

http://www.powerflare.com/

Vaccum bag the flares for water tightness and then store in the PVC.

Good idea, the vaccum bag can be torn with the teeth if there is no knife available. That's what I used to carry some extra rounds for the PH, I don't know why I didn't think of it. Looks like problem solved. A lenght of slim PVC with a screw on cap holding 3 vaccum sealed flares and zip tied to one of the handles of my lifeguard can float.

Make sure to seal each flare seperately for obvious reasons.

I like this flare idea. It is a good solution to stop a full out emergency rescue effort. I need one I can aim and hit my boat driver in the back of the head though!:D
Remember there are smoke flares for daytime and the CG required boat flares that IMO are worthless. Many think those required flares shoot up or spray major brightness. Really all they do is burn like a torch for awhile. These required flares are super outdated if you ask me. Go light a few expired ones and you'll find you might not even be able to get one to light. The igniters go bad with condensation and just smudge off, the ones that do light are unimpressive. Smoke flares, that you know will work, or something like that is what you need. Testing a launched type flare is not a good idea (illegal), but the unimpressive handheld required flares can be lit in your driveway and are no threat to attracting any attention.
I will follow this thread for recomeneded flares. I think it's a great idea to nip the simple lost diver due to current type situation before a 100% CG rescue needs to be called in. The biggest concern for me is reliability of the flare and where I will carry it, so it is 100% out of my way and no drag.

I especially like the smoke flare idea. I can see where that could be much more effective than a meteor flare during daylight hours. Can anyone offer specific advice on brands, makes, styles, etc. of smoke flares that they have used? Length of burn, density of smoke, etc.

Thanks.

Tin Man

I was reading that the launched type flares don't go very high nor burn very bright or long. Can anyone recommend a reliable brand? Someone said that smoke flares are not very visible, they were lumped together with dye which was said to not be very visible.

I'm looking at signalling devices from the perspective of who's attention I'm trying to attract, a boat or a plane. I think sound signals are a wash, in a little bit of a counter breeze you will not be heard. You can count on them under normal circumstances to be picked up from 100 yards away but not in an emergency. Best to concentrate on visual signals. Unless you carry a radio but I'd put that in a different category.

I am going to buy a pack of the Skyflares just so I can see for my self. West marine has them.

http://www.divernet.com/cgi-bin/articles.pl?id=2565&section=1003&action=display&show=

Very interesting study and results. Might want to read before deciding what you want to bring with you.

I am going to buy a pack of the Skyflares just so I can see for my self. West marine has them.I'm holding off on the purchase until you post the results. I hope they'll be better than the 6v battery..

Im buying a Dive Alert now...Still looking into flare or smoke possibilites.

I teach a boating safety class here at work. For that class, we actually shoot off different types of flares. Far and away the best set up for us divers are the military "pen" flares that the Navy gives their pilots.

They consist of a small aluminum tube the size of a ball point pen. The cartridges are about the size of a .357 shell. You cock the spring loaded firing pin, screw on a cartridge and shoot it. The go far higher and burn brighter and longer than the Orion 12 gauge or Skyblazer style flares.

I'll hunt around on the web and see if I can find a source.

I think regular boat flares double sealed with your vacume sealer,..and and inflatable multi colored beach ball wouldn't take up much room and would be inexspensive

I like the idea of using a combination of old-school and new-school safety equipment.

My list now includes:
mirror
flares
flourescent streamer

personal locator beacon
small vhf

I think all of this could fit in a small container mounted similarly to a pony tank and would make rescue at the surface much more of a sure thing.

I think I read in the "lost at sea" thread on SB that someone from the CG told them that smoke flares and dyes are very ineffective in assisting the rescue personnel in locating the lost individual.

IMO the personal location beacon would be the best value for being rescued in a relatively short period of time. Obviously this would be the last resort when the Dive Alert, mirror, whistle, trash bag, etc. could not obtain the attention of surrounding boats.

Hey guys! I've been rethinking all of my safety equipment and have been doing research online and came across this. Anyone have feedback on this? It seems like a great idea to prevent, well, you know! Here's the link: http://www.seamarshall-us.com/plb8ld_us.html

I teach a boating safety class here at work. For that class, we actually shoot off different types of flares. Far and away the best set up for us divers are the military "pen" flares that the Navy gives their pilots.

They consist of a small aluminum tube the size of a ball point pen. The cartridges are about the size of a .357 shell. You cock the spring loaded firing pin, screw on a cartridge and shoot it. The go far higher and burn brighter and longer than the Orion 12 gauge or Skyblazer style flares.

I'll hunt around on the web and see if I can find a source.


I have had no luck in finding an American source for these Pencil Flares, if you have one (source) please share.

Why not get the flares that shoot out of the pistol. Then all you have to do is water proof the shotgun shaped shells. They dont take up as much space as the single shot tubes and you can cary alot of shells.

http://www.defender.com/images/552277.jpg

Brian

That looks very interesting. It is compact and is made especially for divers. I will have to look into it a little more. I am going to be at DEMA and will check to see if they have a booth and pick up some information.

Charlie

Thanks Charlie It seems like a great idea to me although we don't have strong currents like the east coast but you never know!
Brien

After looking through all this stuff, I agree with Nsearch. One of the PLB like this one (http://www.boatersworld.com/product/396200479.htm) is probably our best bet to be found.

I prefer to things simple and low tech. (yes, there should be an EPIRB for the boat)

If Daylight deploy Large (6 foot or better) safety sausage. OMS, Zeagle, Halcyon, Carter Bag, et cetera make good ones. Clip something to base of sausage (speargun, weightbelt, flashlight) to float erect. In high winds a sausage works poorly. A flag with velcro could be attached to speargun/shaft. For tank divers, in the Galapagos Islands (diving 600 miles offshore) and some parts of the UK they use folding Flags (like tent pole or with bungee). The suggestion made earlier to use yellow, orange or white trash bags tied together is good. A mirror works great in daylight and OK in full moon. (a real signal mirror beats a CD-ROM).

Storm whistles are the loudest.
(DiveAlert is far louder, but useless for freediving or scuba divers with empty cylinder.)

Carry Cyalume chem-light sticks. (White & red can be seen farther than green on night vision equipment.) Tie 4-6 feet of line to the end of the chemlight stick & twirl in the air ABOVE YOUR HEAD & WAVE TOPS. Makes a larger more noticeable target. (advice from a USCG SAR flyer & diver)

Carry a strobe. See Jotron, Tek-tite, PrincetonTech, ACR. If strobe uses AA batteries put in Lithium AA - longer run time, better in cold water, longer shelf life.

A tight-beam flashlight can be seen for long distance IF you know which way to point it.

Some UW photo strobes can be set to SOS. Any camera strobe could be aimed at a boat or aircraft.

I put a whistle, mirror, chemlights, strobe, & dyemarker (all small) in one thigh pocket of my wetsuit or drysuit. This will work for freedivers. You can roll up & place sausage in small of back under wetsuit top above belt (for freedivers), or attach to weightbelt in small of back (Riffe & Dive-Rite sell pouches for this) or put in pouch attached to harness or BC for scuba divers.
I like having it in my thigh pocket. If i drop weights or gear I still have something. If I fall overboard while taking a leak from the swim deck I still have something. Freedivers can put gear in thigh pocket and some on their surface float.

Please dive safely.

I think I read in the "lost at sea" thread on SB that someone from the CG told them that smoke flares and dyes are very ineffective in assisting the rescue personnel in locating the lost individual.


That was me and it's a fact. While it's better than nothing, smoke and dye markers are very hard to see unless you are right on top of them. You can't even see dye marker from a surface vessel unless you run it over.

A real-life example:

Back in 1983 I was on the CG Cutter Munro as part of the search for the Korean Airliner that the Soviets shot down.

A helo from the USS Badger lost a tail rotor about thirty miles north of us and crashed with four POB. We took off that direction and fortuntely found them before they died of hypothermia. Right then and there I came to the conclusion that dye marker won't help you be found, it will only turn your body green when they recover it.

I also learned that even though all four crewmembers had aerial flares, they were so hypothermic they couldn't fire them. We sighted them because they tied themselves together to stay warm and that "blob" in the water is what a sharp-eyed sailor on the signal bridge, 52 feet above sea level, was able to see.

I think maybe the signalling issue should be approached with a combination of both and active and passive means. Active methods like flares, smoke, and mirrors require you to see your rescuers and deploy the device. Passive methods like strobes, white trash bags, SMB's and EPIRBs are more of a one time deployment and you just wait for someone to see it...even if you are passed out, hypothermic or otherwise unaware.

Just carrying the stuff is not enough, you need to be proficient in their use and be able to deploy them in pitch black conditions while being pounded by six-foot waves...a lost diver doesn't have a choice in the conditions, he must adapt and be able to function.

ACR ELECTRONICS CAME OUT WITH A PERSONAL LOCATOR BEACON THE SIZE OF A CELL PHONE. IT IS COMPLETELY WATERPROOF, YOU CAN ATTACHED IT TO YOUR BELT AND IF YOU NEED IT, YOU ACTIVATE IT,IT WILL PROVIDE UR EXACT GPS LOCATION. IT HAS 31 HOURS OF OPERATING LIFE AFTER BEING ACTIVATED. YOU GUYS CAN CHECK IT OUT AT WWW.ACRELECTRONICS.COM

ACR ELECTRONICS CAME OUT WITH A PERSONAL LOCATOR BEACON THE SIZE OF A CELL PHONE. IT IS COMPLETELY WATERPROOF, YOU CAN ATTACHED IT TO YOUR BELT AND IF YOU NEED IT, YOU ACTIVATE IT,IT WILL PROVIDE UR EXACT GPS LOCATION. IT HAS 31 HOURS OF OPERATING LIFE AFTER BEING ACTIVATED. YOU GUYS CAN CHECK IT OUT AT WWW.ACRELECTRONICS.COM


You'd still have to seal it in some kind of canister to, but it would be nice to have one.


From ACR's site:
"Exceeds RTCM waterproof requirements for Category 1 (buoyant) PLBs, tested to 5 meters".

ACR ELECTRONICS CAME OUT WITH A PERSONAL LOCATOR BEACON THE SIZE OF A CELL PHONE. IT IS COMPLETELY WATERPROOF, YOU CAN ATTACHED IT TO YOUR BELT AND IF YOU NEED IT, YOU ACTIVATE IT,IT WILL PROVIDE UR EXACT GPS LOCATION. IT HAS 31 HOURS OF OPERATING LIFE AFTER BEING ACTIVATED. YOU GUYS CAN CHECK IT OUT AT WWW.ACRELECTRONICS.COM



Hey felix look up a couple posts to number 43

http://www.halcyon.net/mc/dlr.shtml

this looks like a nice product

What if what you had was permanantly sealed at both ends but the storage material was sturdy enough to stand the pressure, however a quick shot with your knife could break the cylinder to open?

Otherwise you could make the one screw on side slotted so you can put your knife in there to turn it or make a tool to open the end.

just a couple of thoughts...